Episode 604 Show Notes- Trump-Zelenskyy Confrontation: What It Means for Ukraine

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Episode Description

A major diplomatic rift erupted in the Oval Office between President Trump, Vice President Vance, and Ukraine’s President Zelenskyy, one that could cost Ukraine dearly. In this episode of The P.A.S. Report Podcast, Professor Nick Giordano breaks down the video clip everyone is talking about and the deeper geopolitical consequences. More importantly, he exposes why President Trump is the only one who has laid out a viable strategy that could end the war, weaken Russia, and strengthen America’s global influence – so why are so many trying to sabotage it? Tune in to find out.

Episode Highlights:

• Zelenskyy’s disastrous meeting with Trump & Vance and what it reveals.
• The rules of effective diplomacy, how every nation, including Russia, Ukraine, and the U.S., acts in self-interest, and why that’s not bad.
• Why does Europe refuse to step up despite the claims of Russia as an existential threat?
• The media & Democrats’ desperate resistance to President Trump comes at a huge cost.

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Show Notes- Trump-Zelenskyy Confrontation: What It Means for Ukraine

Timestamps

00:00 Introduction to the Chaos of Diplomacy
01:55 Analyzing Zelenskyy’s Diplomatic Missteps
09:04 The Role of Power in International Relations
12:27 International Politics is about self-interests
17:00 European Hypocrisy and the Ukraine Conflict
19:16 Is Russia really the existential threat Europe claims?
21:23 Europe plays both sides?
24:00 Europeans aren’t the only ones that Virtue Signal
25:02 The American Political Landscape and Peace Talks
29:59 How would President Trump’s plan work?

 

 

Welcome to The P.A.S. Report Podcast

[Auto-Generated Transcript]

Hello everyone, and welcome to The P.A.S. Report Podcast. I’m your host, Professor Nick Giordano. Be sure to follow and subscribe to the podcast so you never miss an episode, and go to The P.A.S. Report website at pasreport.com to sign up for my newsletter, read the show notes, and share the episode with family and friends.

Now, there are so many moving parts happening at the same time, so I’m going to jump right in today. I have to talk about the video that everyone has seen, everyone has witnessed. I watched it probably over 40 times. Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy came to the United States, stepping into the Oval Office, and total chaos is unfolding. It just spirals out of control.

Zelenskyy is someone who doesn’t understand the mechanics of diplomacy- Diplomacy 101. And I want to get right to the video. I want to play it because I will critique it in real time. I want to show you where it went off the rails. A lot of people want to blame Trump. They want to blame J.D. Vance. But the truth is, this is all on Zelensky, and this is what happens when you grow arrogant.

I get it, his nation is fighting a war right now. But he failed Diplomacy 101.

So, let’s start the video. I’ll go through it, and I’ll pause at certain moments to give you some insights into my thoughts.

Trump – Zelenski Video

Now, before we get into it, I have to set this up a little bit. This was about a 48-minute meeting in total. The first 37 to 38 minutes were going along fine, with standard protocol and answering questions. Then a Polish reporter asked a question: Is Trump being too nice to Vladimir Putin? And Trump explains that if you want to sit down and negotiate with someone, you can’t just slam them right off the bat.

I’ll get into that more.

Then J.D. Vance chimes in, talking about how America’s strength comes from its diplomacy. And that’s the truth. When we look at how America rose to become a superpower, it was because of our innovation, military might, territorial expansion, but also because we were actually good at diplomacy. We had real foreign policy experts here in the United States.

Unfortunately, we don’t have those experts anymore because they’ve taken us from one disaster to another. And the same holds true with the Ukrainian disaster unfolding before our eyes.

But notice when Vance talks about diplomacy and look at Zelensky’s face.

Right there, you see the arrogance. Zelensky makes a critical error: he doesn’t acknowledge the support that has been provided to him. Yes, in 2014, Russia took Crimea. But what he doesn’t acknowledge is that when Trump came into office, the situation began to calm down. Trump provided Zelenskyy and Ukraine with highly sophisticated military weapons, and Zelenskyy should have acknowledged that. Instead, he acts as if the world was ignoring Ukraine. That wasn’t the case.

We all played critical roles in this. You have Senator Chris Murphy, who I’ll talk about at the end of this episode, bragging about how the United States encouraged the protests and the downfall of the previous Ukrainian regime back in 2014. There’s guilt there. We have to admit that.

But Zelensky goes on, and what you’re witnessing in this video is key. He asks Vice President J.D. Vance a question: What kind of diplomacy are you talking about? Before Vance even opens his mouth, Zelensky has this arrogant, angry look on his face, crosses his arms, and rolls his eyes. You could see Trump is getting angry with Zelenskyy but allows it to go on.

And that’s the moment the meeting, which had been going fine up until this point, becomes confrontational, not because of what Vice President Vance said, but because Zelensky was already on the attack. What’s wrong with diplomacy? If we can negotiate with other countries, we have an obligation to do that. War should always be a last resort. War is what happens when you’re out of diplomatic options, and then you use it as a tool of diplomacy.

Yet here, you have Zelensky talking down to Vice President Vance, and I think that’s what annoyed President Trump the most. That and rejecting the idea of a diplomatic solution. But how do wars end? Wars end diplomatically, or they end with an unconditional surrender, where one side has been overwhelmingly defeated by another military.

Zelenskyy should have realized that.

But instead, he makes it clear—he has no interest in diplomacy.

And that’s where you see that President Trump has had enough.

The meeting went on for another few minutes after that, but looking at it in its entirety, this was truly amazing. And I’m going to break it all down after this quick break.

Break

The Rules of Effective Diplomacy & National Interests

Welcome back to The P.A.S. Report Podcast. So, we just played a decent-sized clip of what transpired between Trump and Zelensky. And at the end, you can see that Trump had enough with Zelenskyy, and Zelenskyy failed Diplomacy 101. Diplomacy is not about emotions or moral platitudes. It’s not about what’s right and wrong. The international community doesn’t care about what’s moral or immoral. History is replete with examples of that.

Sometimes, you have to accept that unfair things are going to happen.

Every nation acts in its own self-interest; we have to be realistic about that. And when looking at self-interest, I have to analyze Zelensky. What was he thinking? What was going through his mind? Because you never bite the hand that feeds you.

There are rules for effective diplomacy. One of those rules is that you have to be realistic. You have to understand what’s attainable. More importantly, you have to be careful with the way you communicate. We communicate through our words, but we also communicate through body language. And Zelenskyy’s body language said it all.

It showed disdain for the President of the United States. It showed disdain for the Vice President of the United States. It showed a complete disregard for resolving the conflict through diplomacy.

And what was Zelensky going to gain from that? I simply don’t understand it. Zelensky was unwilling to be flexible, unwilling to play the game, the diplomatic dance. And he did enormous damage to his country. Now, he can repair it, and I suspect he will. There’s likely a lot of pressure behind the scenes, both within Ukraine and from European partners and American politicians, pressuring Zelensky to make this right.

But let’s be clear: this is not Trump’s fault. It’s not J.D. Vance’s fault. Zelenskyy got disgusted the moment diplomacy was mentioned. That much was clear. It was clear in his face, in his body language, and in his words.

And that was a failure. There are diplomatic protocols that need to be followed, and Zelensky should understand that he is the weaker nation. When you are negotiating with a more powerful nation like the United States, the one that has kept you in the fight against Russia, you have to listen, not dictate. You have to understand where we’re coming from, and you can’t snap back, particularly in public when the media is present.

That’s exactly what Zelenskyy did. It was a failure of Diplomacy 101. He needs to realize that, whether it’s right or wrong, he is in a weaker position. And yes, he is going to have to capitulate to the superpowers. That’s just the nature of the beast on the international stage.

I’m not arguing about morality or whether things are right or wrong. We are the dominant country. He has to accept that. And if he doesn’t, then we have to be willing to walk away. We have to be willing to get up. And that’s exactly what Trump did, he just ended it. He said, We’re done here.

You begin to understand this when you apply the levels of analysis in world politics to examine why leaders make the decisions they do and why they behave the way they do. When we look at the war in Ukraine, let’s ask the key question: Is Vladimir Putin going to act in Russia’s interest? Of course, he’s the leader of Russia.

It’s in Russia’s interest to ensure that Ukraine pledges neutrality and doesn’t join NATO. It’s in Russia’s interest to continue seizing Ukrainian land so that they have more leverage at the bargaining table. It’s in Russia’s interest to expand its territory, to get the world to recognize Crimea as part of Russia, and to gain international recognition of parts of eastern Ukraine. Again, I’m not saying this is right. I’m simply pointing out what is in Russia’s interest.

Now, let’s look at Ukraine. Zelenskyy is in a position of weakness. He knows what’s happening on the battlefield. He knows his troops are being pushed back. He knows that Russia is slowly grinding away and taking more and more territory.

So what is Zelenskyy’s strategy? What does he believe is in his country’s best interest—and, frankly, in his own personal best interest? He wants the United States and European countries to commit boots on the ground and take the war directly to Putin.

I’ve said it before—this isn’t rocket science. The only way Ukraine can achieve victory over Russia is if the United States and Europe declare war and send troops to fight Russia. That is the only scenario where Ukraine could hope to recapture its entire country, including Crimea, and entertain the idea of joining NATO in the future. That’s it.

So for Zelenskyy, prolonging the war is actually in his interest. He believes that if the war drags on and the situation becomes increasingly desperate, Putin will make a miscalculation. He hopes that at some point, the United States and Europe will be thrust into the war, coming to Ukraine’s direct defense with American and NATO troops.

It’s a short-sighted strategy, and I’ll explain why. But for now, understand that this is Zelensky’s national interest.

Now, let’s consider America’s national interest. Trump wants a resolution. He believes that ending the war is in America’s best interest. He wants to secure this mineral deal, which he sees as strategically vital for the United States. And he’s right. This deal would reduce our reliance on China, strengthen our economic position, and ensure stability in the region.

So here we have three countries – Ukraine, Russia, and the United States – all operating in their own self-interest. But the shortsightedness of Zelenskyy’s approach is that he fails to see how Trump’s proposal actually benefits Ukraine and weakens Russia.

Now, let’s talk about aid. If we continue to pump weapons and money into Ukraine, what does it really accomplish? Trump has already announced that Ukrainian aid has been suspended for the foreseeable future, probably until Zelenskyy apologizes. There are consequences to your behavior.

But even if the aid were to continue, all it would do is maintain the status quo. It wouldn’t resolve the situation. In fact, it would make things worse for Ukraine in the long run. Because the longer this war drags on, the more inevitable it becomes that Ukraine’s military will collapse. Morale in Ukraine is already drained. 50% of the Ukrainian people want an agreement. They want the war to end.

Three years in a war zone is a long time. People are tired. They want to get back to their lives. So the real question is: How much longer can this support last?

That’s the reality. When we look at negotiations, we have to assume that both parties are operating in good faith. But if neither Putin nor Zelensky is willing to negotiate in good faith, this war isn’t going to end anytime soon.

What we are witnessing on the world stage is nothing more than power politics. The left likes to claim that Ukraine is the front line of democracy. That’s a joke. That’s not true.

This is about realpolitik. And, unfortunately, too much of our foreign policy is driven by emotions rather than realism. It’s based on feelings rather than logic and reason. The virtue signalers will come out and call me an appeaser for saying this. But the reality is, I’m simply being realistic about the situation as it is.

And I’ll talk more about the virtue signalers when we get back from this quick break.

So everyone, hang tight, we’ll be right back.

Break

Is Putin and Russia an Existential Threat? It Seems that Europe Doesn’t Believe So as Dispute Between Trump and Zelenskyy Opens

Welcome back to The P.A.S. Report Podcast.

Now, I want to take on the European hypocrisy that’s going on because, frankly, Europe is really aggravating me. You have Europeans claiming that Ukraine is the front line for freedom, the front line for liberty. They say that if we lose this war, that’s it, it’s the 1930s all over again, and Putin is going to march through Europe like the next Hitler.

These are the same leaders, the same ones, who preach about freedom while throwing people in prison for a tweet. They will throw you in prison for a social media post. These are the same countries that have no regard for the principles of free speech. These are the same countries –Sweden being the exception – that had no problem locking people in their homes during COVID, dictating which businesses were essential and which weren’t.

They dictated when, where, and how people could practice their faith. And yet, they want to talk about freedom? They don’t care about freedom. Just look at how authoritarian Europe has become.

It’s all designed around their belief that the government should control behavior. So, this isn’t about freedom. And it’s not about Putin being an existential threat to Europe or the rest of the world. That’s another myth being pushed.

Understand this: the United States and Russia are always going to be adversaries. Our foreign policies conflict with each other. And when I say conflict, I don’t mean we’re necessarily going to war. The European Union and the United States also have economic conflicts. We are in competition. They are looking out for what’s in their best interest, and we are looking out for what’s in ours. So, when I say conflict and adversarial, I don’t mean that in a purely negative sense.

Russia seeks to increase its power and influence around the world. It wants to expand its sphere of influence. The United States seeks to maintain its dominance. That’s the reality of geopolitics.

Foreign policy is about power. And there’s a constant competition throughout the world for power. Power is a zero-sum game, one country gains power at the expense of another. If Russia gains power, the United States or a country like China loses power. We have to keep that in mind.

Now, let’s talk about the European response. They claim this is an existential threat to Europe and to the United States, that we must ensure Ukraine wins this war. But does their rhetoric match their actions?

Let’s look at the numbers. The 27 countries of the European Union combined are contributing only 0.2% of their GDP to support Ukraine. Now, compare that to the United States—one country—which is also contributing 0.2% of GDP.

That’s odd, isn’t it? If this is truly an existential threat, why aren’t European nations pumping in more money, more military equipment? If the future of Western civilization is at stake, isn’t it worth at least 20% of GDP? 30%?

They argue, “Well, we can’t spend that much because our economies would collapse.” But if Putin were truly an existential threat, if he were about to march through Europe and exterminate entire populations, wouldn’t the economy be the last thing on your mind?

When you start asking these questions, the hypocrisy becomes undeniable. The difference between the words spoken on the international stage and the actions taken behind the scenes is staggering.

But it goes even deeper. If Putin is really the next Hitler, if this really is the 1930s all over again, why hasn’t a single European country committed to putting boots on the ground?

Yes, the United Kingdom’s Prime Minister Starmer recently said they would pledge 20,000 troops—but only after a negotiated settlement takes place, and even then, they would only be peacekeepers. But if Putin is truly an existential threat, don’t we need to eliminate him? Don’t we need to destroy Russia to ensure this supposed threat doesn’t engulf the Western world?

It’s revealing, isn’t it? But the most revealing thing of all is when you follow the money.

Europe isn’t just failing to put boots on the ground, they’re also happy to let the United States bankroll this entire war. But here’s where it gets even more absurd.

In 2024, the European Union imported a record 16.5 million metric tons of liquefied natural gas (LNG) from Russia. That surpasses the 15.2 million metric tons imported in 2023. Let’s break it down in dollars. Last year, Europe spent $255 billion on Russian LNG. Since February 2022, Europe has spent $893 billion on Russian LNG. Now, let’s juxtapose that with what they’ve given to Ukraine. The European Union has provided Ukraine with $73 billion in economic aid—35% of which is a loan that Ukraine has to pay back. On top of that, they’ve contributed $53 billion in military equipment.

So, let’s do the math. Europe has given Russia four times more money than they have given Ukraine. At what point does absurdity reach a tipping point? Europe has literally funded both sides of this war. They virtue signal about defending Ukraine while simultaneously bankrolling Russia’s war machine.

Does that make sense to anyone? Does it sound like Russia is an existential threat when Europe is still buying its energy at record levels?

And just to be clear, I’m not supporting Russia. I support the United States of America. I support what’s in our best interest, not Russia’s, not Ukraine’s. I don’t care about what’s in Russia’s best interest. I don’t care about what’s in Ukraine’s best interest.

Unlike the virtue signalers out there, I don’t lie to myself. I admit it, I look out for what’s in our strategic interest.

Yes, war is ugly. People are dying. War is hell. War is about death and destruction to achieve political objectives. That’s what war is. But again, if Europe truly believes Putin is an existential threat, why aren’t they doing more? Why do they want to keep this war going?

What purpose does it serve? That’s the important question we need to ask ourselves.

We’re going to take a quick break. When we get back, I’m going to talk about some of the Democrats here at home. I’m going to talk about Trump’s peace plan. I’m going to talk about why so many want to sabotage it.

So, everyone hang tight, we’ll be right back.

Break

Opposition to Peace, Trump’s Peace Plan, and Zelenskyy Must Make Nice with Trump

Welcome back to The P.A.S. Report Podcast.

I just went through how Europe is full of hypocrites, but so is America. There are so many Americans who love to virtue signal. They want to sound tough, pat themselves on the back, and act like they’re the moral holy warriors of the 21st century.

But what are they doing? What problems are they solving? They put a little Ukrainian flag in their social media profiles: Slava Ukraine! But what are they accomplishing? Do they want peace? Some may, but it’s easy to say the war should continue when you have no stake in the game.

It’s the same thing when it comes to human rights. I tell my students all the time—they lie to themselves. Because that’s what people do. I ask them, How many of you care about human rights? And, of course, they all raise their hands. They rush to show how virtuous they are.

Well, if they really cared about human rights, wouldn’t they know that 85% of the products they own were made under exploitative conditions? If they truly understood what goes into manufacturing those products, they would figure out a different way forward.

So it’s easy to say you care about human rights, but actually living by that code is much harder. If you live by that code, life gets more difficult. You have to make real sacrifices. But let’s be honest; just look at where everything is made. A lot of it comes from countries that have no regard for human rights.

The same principle applies to Ukraine. It’s easy to say that Ukraine should defeat Russia! But if you step back and look at the situation objectively, you’ll realize that without U.S. and European boots on the ground, that’s almost impossible to do.

So, are these people who virtue signal willing to send America’s sons and daughters off to die for Ukraine’s cause? Now it becomes a different story.

But what aggravates me is the Democrats. It seems that Democrats and their allies oppose peace talks not on principle but simply because Trump is leading them. Let’s be honest—how many world leaders have introduced a proposal to end this war?

How many of them have come out and forcefully, unequivocally stated that they want to end this war and that they have a viable solution to do so? How many Democrats in the U.S. have put forward a real proposal to end the war in Ukraine? How many? None. Their only solution is to keep the war going. Now, here’s what I find interesting. Last Tuesday, I recorded my podcast and talked about the mineral deal. That episode was released on Wednesday. By Tuesday evening, there were reports that the mineral deal had been agreed to and that Zelensky would be coming later in the week to sign it.

Then, Zelensky arrived in Washington on Friday. He was scheduled to meet with Trump in the Oval Office. They were supposed to have a press conference, then go to lunch, and then later in the day, hold a signing ceremony. But something changed. So what happened?

Apparently, a few hours before meeting with Trump, Zelensky sat down with Democrats. And in that meeting, we have none other than Senator Chris Murphy from Connecticut.

Murphy is an interesting character. He seems to spend more time online than actually doing his job. The other day, he posted this on X: “Over the last 24 hours, MAGA has been ceaselessly spreading the claim that Democrats—from Susan Rice to Tony Blinken to me—pushed Zelensky to reject the minerals deal. This is a total lie. It’s made up out of thin air. Zero sources to prove it.”

He posted that on Monday. But here’s what he posted on Friday, the day Zelensky met with Democrats before his meeting with Trump: “Just finished a meeting with President Zelensky here in Washington. He confirmed that the Ukrainian people will not support a fake peace agreement where Putin gets everything he wants and there are no security arrangements for Ukraine.”

So, we need to ask the question: What happened in that meeting?

I want to see a full transcript of that meeting. What was discussed? What was said? I’m sure there’s a transcript available. Someone probably recorded something. Wouldn’t it be nice if we had an actual press that tried to figure this out? But of course, we don’t have an honest press in this country.

Think about it, the deal was supposed to be signed. And then, all of a sudden, everything goes off the rails. So what happened? That’s what I want to know. That’s what we should be demanding from Senator Chris Murphy. Because what I see is one person trying to put forward a real solution. One person. And that person is President Trump. No one else is doing it.

When we look at the short-sightedness of Democrats, of Zelensky, of Europeans—we have to go beyond the surface level. What was this mineral deal supposed to do? Zelenskyy would sign a partnership agreement with the U.S. on mineral extraction. Ukraine cannot extract these minerals on its own. We do.

So the smart move is to get the deal done first and then start peace talks. That’s how you win. Unfortunately, there are a lot of people in this country who don’t like to win. They like the U.S. to get taken advantage of. But this was a way to secure peace while also ensuring American economic and strategic interests.

Ukraine would have to pledge neutrality. That’s just a reality. They would also have to recognize Crimea as part of Russia, and they might lose some eastern provinces. Is that fair? No. But that’s what Russia would agree to. And what does Russia get? The prevention of NATO expansion. Now, here’s where the real strategy comes in.

By signing this mineral deal, the U.S. gains an economic foothold in Ukraine. That means American personnel would be on the ground, involved in extraction and rebuilding efforts.

That alone is a deterrent against Russian invasion. If U.S. personnel are in Ukraine, Putin is far less likely to invade. Because if he does, and an American is killed? That changes the game entirely. I’ve already explained the short-sightedness of Democrats. They can’t accept this deal because Trump proposed it.

That’s the reality. They are blinded by hatred. Anything Trump proposes, they have to reject. They have to dismiss it outright. And here’s the kicker: they’re siding with a foreign leader over the President of the United States. Why? Because Trump resolving this war would benefit him politically. If Obama proposed this deal, they would be celebrating him as a genius. They’d already be talking about the Nobel Peace Prize. But because it’s Trump? They oppose it.

Zelenskyy did enormous damage to himself by backing out of this deal. I have no doubt that American politicians played a role in that. But if he thinks this war can continue indefinitely, he’s in for a rude awakening. The longer it goes on, the worse it will be for Ukraine.

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